Apr
10
2007
Debian 4.0 (Etch)
Posted by luna6 83 Comments
After 21 months of development Debian has released version 4.0 codenamed Etch to the public on April, 8th 2007. In Debian time 21 months is downright snippy, which is a good thing. Trust me on that. Their last (in)famous release Debian 3.1 “Sarge” took a near vista-esque length of time for release (3+ years), so here’s hoping the colorful Debian gang can keep up to their more reasonable year and a half release cycle.
In fairness to the Debian group, their releases have always been held up on a pedestal for its stability and security. Debian’s strong points are definitely in the server arena, but that’s not to say Debian can’t work well as an everyday workstation. After all Ubuntu, Xandros, Lindows are all based off of Debian.
Because Debian Etch has taken “only” 21 months for release, the software included in this release feels relatively cutting edge, at least compared with Sarge. These are some of the more important packages that comes with Debian Etch :
2.6.18 Kernel
GNOME 2.14
KDE 3.5
Xfce 4.4
OpenOffice.org 2.0.4a
Evolution 2.6.3
iceweasel (Firefox) 2.0
Gimp 2.2.13
Apache 2.2
MySQL 5.0
Gaim 2.0
Although Debian can be downloaded in an astounding 21 cd set or 3 dvd set, you can go for the netinstall image which comes in at a paltry 180 megabytes. I chose to download the 3 dvd’s via bittorrent, figuring the net install would be a better choice later on (once their servers settles down). From going through the installation procedure I did find out that you can download just the first dvd and install Etch (for software packages I selected just the Desktop Environment & Standard System options). Any additional applications can easily be download via APT, once you have you the system installed. As expected the installation went fairly smoothly, the installer not having changed much since the Sarge days. This is actually good thing, since the Ubuntu people will already be familiar with the installer used in Etch.
As an alternative, Debian has included a nice graphical installer. To install with the graphical installer, when you first boot up with Debian install disc, type installgui at the first command prompt.
Once the installation completed, I booted up into a garbled & frozen GDM login screen. This was actually expected, since I have had the same problems with Sarge and quite a few other distros (all but the latest Ubuntu / Fedora / Mandriva releases). What’s more perplexing is that the hardware on my test computer is not at all that esoteric. A custom built computer that includes an AMD X2 4400 CPU, 2 gigs of ram, Nvidia 6600 GT video card, and integrated motherboard components for the rest of the system. The most esoteric component I have is a 24″ Samsung 244T LCD monitor.
Fortunately the problem with the frozen and garbled gdm screen wasn’t very difficult to fix. I had my computer set up as dual boot system already, so I just rebooted into another Linux distro, mounted the Debian partition, opened up the xorg.conf file via the terminal, and changed the drivers from “nv” to “vesa.” After that and a reboot, Debian loaded fine except my screen was running at a really low resolution. If anybody has a similar problem and don’t have a dual boot configuration, they can easily use any old live disc, to edit their xorg.conf file.
Since Debian was running off of the generic vesa driver and the “nv” drivers were not working, it was time to update to the proprietary Nvidia drivers. The drivers available in the Debian repositories are the older 1.0.8776-4 version, which works fine, but they don’t have the features necessary to work with the latest Beryl 3d effects, so I went straight for the latest Nvidia drivers available on the the Nvidia website.
Note there are alternate ways to install Nvidia drivers and the Debian folks actually recommend installing Nvidia drivers the “Debian” way. Those instructions can be accessed here.
Before doing this, I first first added the non-free Debian repositories to my /etc/apt/sources.list and then updated my system. This is my sources.list after adding the non-free repositories :
deb http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/ etch main contrib non-free
deb http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main contrib non-free
# deb-src http://security.debian.org/ etch/updates main contrib non-free
Once that was modified, I needed to do a few more things to get ready for the Nvidia installation.
su -
apt-get update
apt-get install build-essential
then I had to type in the terminal
uname -r
to find out what kernel version I was running. The kernel I had was 2.6.18-4-k7. From there I installed the kernel headers by typing in the terminal as root user :
apt-get install linux-headers-2.6.18-4-k7
Obviously you should type “uname -r” in the terminal to find out which kernel you are running and install the appropriate linux headers for that particular kernel. As an example if you have 2.6.18-4-686 then you should install linux-headers-2.6.18-4-686.
From there I downloaded the drivers from Nvidia via :
wget http://us.download.nvidia.com/XFree86/Linux-x86/1.0-9755/
NVIDIA-Linux-x86-1.0-9755-pkg1.run
I then logged out Gnome and hit Cntrl+Alt+F1 to drop into a basic shell. To be on the safe side I also typed in the terminal :
su -
/etc/init.d/gdm stop
After that I changed into the directory where the Nvidia drivers were downloaded and as root user typed in :
sh NVIDIA-Linux-x86-1.0-9755-pkg1.run
From there a familiar Nvidia installation wizard ran me through the Nvidia installation. Once the installation was over I typed in the terminal :
startx
and I was back into Debian Etch, but now running at my monitor’s 1920×1200 native resolution.
I was half way there but I still needed to install Beryl. The procedure was pretty easy. I had to first add two new repositories to my /etc/apt/sources.list :
deb http://debian.beryl-project.org/ etch main
deb-src http://debian.beryl-project.org/ etch main
then in the terminal install the gpg key for that repository via :
wget -O - http://debian.beryl-project.org/root@lupine.me.uk.gpg | sudo apt-key add -
after that :
su -
apt-get install beryl-manager emerald-themes
Beryl was installed but I had to manually edit the xorg.conf to make it work with the Nvidia drivers. Basically I did :
su -
nano /etc/X11/xorg.conf
then added these two lines under the “Screen” section :
Option "XAANoOffscreenPixmaps"
Option "AddARGBGLXVisuals" "true"
then added these lines under “Device” :
Option "AllowGLXWithComposite" "true"
Option "RenderAccel" "true"
added one line under “Server Layout” :
Option âAIGLXâ "on"
Finally at the end of the file I added these lines :
Section "Extensions"
Option "Composite" "Enable"
EndSection
With a reboot, beryl and nvidia were doing its magic.
After that it was time to install extra applications that did not come with the default install. A simple
su -
apt-get update
apt-get install vlc mplayer gftp easytag amarok k3b xmms thunderbird sun-java5-jre sun-java5-plugin azureus klibido kftpgrabber rar par2 xpdf digikam xine-ui
got my computer ready for multimedia and internet tasks. Mp3’s played fine, all video formats I tried to play worked, and Sun’s java was running. I then wanted to install KDE which was as easy as :
su -
apt-get install kde
Afterwards, I did want to install a simple ftp program where I could login remotely and transfer files from. so I chose to use vsftpd and the procedure was as easy:
su -
apt-get install vsftpd
nano -w /etc/vsftpd.conf
then edit the line for anonymous_enable from YES to NO :
anonymous_enable=NO
uncomment these two lines :
local_enable=YES
write_enable=YES
then :
/etc/init.d/vsftpd restart
Also having a static ip is useful for running services. The way I setup a static ip :
su -
nano /etc/network/interfaces
and then comment out the iface eth0 line and add these 4 lines (plug in your own network information of course) :
#iface eth0 inet dhcp
iface eth0 inet static
address 192.168.1.85
netmask 255.255.255.0
gateway 192.168.1.1
I did notice that somethings worked differently in Debian than Ubuntu. As an example, If you want to run nautilus as root user I had to type in :
gksu "nautilus --no-desktop --browser"
While using Etch for the first time you may wonder where Firefox is and what happened to Mozilla’s Thunderbird that was installed earlier. Debian made the decision to fork from Firefox & Thunderbird, rather than comply with Mozilla’s licensing requirements. Specifically Mozilla requires that groups use their official builds or don’t use their trademarked logo and name. While most Linux distros complies with Mozilla’s licensing requirements, Debian made the decision to re-brand Firefox as “IceWeasel” and Thunderbird as “IceDove.” I’m sure the Debian group had good intentions behind this move, but I found Debian’s re-branding of Firefox as “IceWeasel” to be unfortunate and quite frankly, immature. I wonder how Debian would feel if I modified their distro for my own purposes, then advertised the distro as being “Debian” along with using their familiar red logo and allowed people from Lunapark6 to download it as Debian?
Although Debian allows users to set up most things the old school way, by modifying text files, there are some nice gui applications built into Debian Etch. If you want to install applications via a gui application or just browse through a list of what programs are available, Synaptic works great as usual. Furthermore adding sharing folders via Samba and NFS worked nicely with the “Shared Folders” application. Adding extra repositories can be done through the âSoftware Preferencesâ app.
For the people that would like to try out Linux for the first time, Ubuntu or Fedora would probably be the better choice. You do have less guification in Debian Etch, but I find that to be a positive rather than a negative. That isn’t to say Debian Etch is a difficult distro to use. In fact my only prior experience with Debian was trying out Sarge for no more than 5 minutes several years ago. Because I regularly use Ubuntu (which is based off of snapshots of Debian releases) I found most things familiar, but with less attempts to appease Windows users. I can remember installing Sarge several years back and after the installation I thought “whats all the fuss?” The packages that came with Sarge were downright archaic, but this is not the case with Etch. Relatively new applications like KDE 3.5, Amarok 1.4.4, Gaim 2.0, and Iceweasal (Firefox) 2.0 ships with Debian Etch. Furthermore I actually had a blast setting up Etch and found the system perfect for my needs. Although Ubuntu’s Feisty Fawn hasn’t been released yet, their steps to “guify” everything in Linux becomes less appealing as the days pass by. With Etch you get the best package manager around in APT, a rock solid stable system, and the ability to tinker with the desktop all that you want – without having the procedure become too arcane (Gentoo?). If you are familiar with Linux then I would strongly recommend you try out Debian Etch – just an awesome release by the Debian group.
Pro’s :
For a Debian release – Etch comes with cutting edge software
Etch feels very fast
APT is still the fastest and most reliable package manager around
Security & Stability is second to none
Con’s :
There are more friendly distro’s for the first time Linux user.
Renaming Firefox as “Iceweasel” was just lame.
Gnome 2.14 comes installed by default – rather than Gnome 2.16
Users Rating: 9.11 
(46 votes)
Loading …
![[del.icio.us]](http://images.del.icio.us/static/img/delicious.small.gif){kind=small}
Comments
83 Comments so far
i’m very shallow concern Linux. please i need some help.
i have installed Debian (etch)as second booting system
but when i boot, it start reading and last come to this point:
Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 kihara tty1
kihara login:(here keyboard insert characters)
password(here nothing happen)
thnx, good tutorialZ :)
Thanks mate! Good review!
Thats a really Great guide! Creds to you, I wish you could describe a little more about the commands though so the user know a little about what he is doing, for example the apt-get install -program list-, you could explain what the program does so everyone dosent install all those programs, some of them may be in excess for the average Joe…
overall Great job creating this guide, please continue! ;)
This was just the most detailed guide I ever used when it comes to linux and recently I’ve just installed ubuntu, debian, fedora, etc and many other about couple of hundred times and there is always something you need to check up on internet and 90% of cases you get the guide from someone / somewhere forums or experts that screw up your efforts and leaves you like a… you know what! Who wrote this guide I would like to say to him that he or she did a very good job. I have my debian etch perfectly running with all the beryl magic.
Thanks!
OMGGGG
I am VERY new to this, JUST installed Debian Etch 4.0, and I would REALLY REALLY like to THANK YOU for this article. I have been trying to install drivers for my nvidia card for about 3 HOURS and this could NOT have been MORE HELPFUL!!!
Not to mention i had MANY other problems i had to fix IE- running a live CD to change the boot/grub/menu.lst so that it would load the OS, and this was AFTER i had to rearrange my hard drives to get the GRUB bootloader to even LOAD
Linux is a PAIN but when you finish something its a feeling like no other
again- THANK YOU SO MUCHHH!!!
I think referring to debian re-branding Firefox builds as “immature” and “lame” just shows a lack of understanding of the issues at stake.
Debian has a se of guidlines – DFSG IIRC – which software in debian has to follow to be distributed. if you take a look at the iceweasal wikipedia entry you will see there was some problems here.
perhaps you would care to read up on it.
Otherwise. Nice one. can you do gNewSEnse and Gobuntu next?
Great review
Thanks for the info, very helpful, managed to get Beryl working in a few minutes!
I am using Debian Etch and so far have only managed to get Beryl to work correctly on a dual screen TwinView setup. Tried the version Compiz that comes with Debian however this just didn’t want to play ball and crashed more often than not.
Had a go of the Compiz Fusion release for Etch however I couldn’t even get this to start up at all which is shame as it’s supposed to be the successor to Beryl?
Thanks again,
Kermit the Frog
Hi, great review help with Windows X, change driver from “nv” to “vesa” and it work like a charm! Now installing Nvidia drivers…
Kelvin
PR, USA
“Renaming Firefox as âIceweaselâ was just lame.” — They didn’t rename it, it’s a whole different build of Mozilla’s Firefox that uses only open-source libraries. It’s not Firefox.
Parabéns pelo tutorial, sempre uso ele quando preciso instalar o beryl ou ate mesmo para indicar a um amigo.
Thanks. Simple and exact. I got it workin second time round:
Note to all that are copy and pasting the commands from this site; the quotes on the AIGLX in the line
Option âAIGLXâ “on”
should be changed to non unicode, as they caused my /etc/X11/xorg.conf file to have errors.
I needed to use a live cd (slax) to correct the file.
a simple restart and all was well
ThanX ;)
Linux Mint 3.0 Cassandra ist Beryl onboard !!
Best Linux
********** !!!
Your review is good but PCLinuxOS is the better OS compared to Debian when it comes to newbies. I went through http://pclinuxos2007.blogspot.com and applied the tricks on my PCLOS. The result was rewarding.
Just installing Debian 4.0 as main system after I it a while on another partition. It is truly a great distro (if not THE distro). The debian team made a big step forward to a more user friendly distribution. Still the installer is not good enough although the best Debian ever had. For example did I struggle to install KDE even with the install tasks=”standard, kde-desktop” command.
However, thank you so much for this great arcticle.
Regards
Peter
I just want to know how can i resolve broken packages in debian etch 40R0. any help is appreciated.
thanks
Great manual!!!
I try’d out a few of them around and wasn’t able to run Debian with Beryl/compiz … this one really did the trick. ;-)
Some screenshots can be seen at:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/begasus/
Sorry to say, but that was a total newb review.
- aptitude is preferred dpkg-frontend
- there is nvidia package in debians repository
- press “e” in grub and add a “3″ behind the line that boots debian, to boot into your system without X starting, so you dont need livecd
- there ARE more friendly distros, but is that a cons for a system that doesnt wants to fulfill this (everybodys) needs? i think not…
- renaming the mozilla apps (not just firefox) is not lame but necessary due to license conflicts cause by official mozilla brandings
the screenshot tour was nice though.
“I tried installing the 32-bit version of Firefox, and it wonât because a âlibgtk-x11.blah.blah.blahâ library was missing. I have tried everything that I can think of to install it, and have read a few ideas through Google, and it flat-out wonât. Nor will SeaMonkey.”
Try installing the 32-bit compatibility deb’s – search for ia32.
Once installed seamonkey and other 32bit things will run fine on your 64 bit machine
Xine-UI works fine for me so I can’t seem to recreate your problem. Maybe try this suggestion.
@pinx
I have the same problem.
I’ve a little problem regarding xine…when i try to start the program it doesen’t work.If i try to launch it from a shell it give’s me this error :
This is xine (X11 gui) – a free video player v0.99.5cvs.
(c) 2000-2006 The xine Team.
can’t create mcop directory
The problem is the directory exists :
pinx@deb-station:~$ whereis mcop
mcop: /usr/lib/mcop
Help!
THANKS for this wonderful tutorial. finally beryl is working!!! NICE
it was not easy to find a tutorial that works so fast and good.
thx
There are 3 CD1 disks you can install from which will give you Gnome, KDE or XFCE. Just CD1 is enough to give you a basic installation with one of these Desktop Environments.
Thanks for your reply, Luna. I will try that out. There are still sooo many things I have to find out about in Linux that I think I’m going to spend some time just tinkering with it before I actually use it as my default OS.
Things like partitioning, which file system to choose, disc encryption (it’s a notebook), a dedicated kernel for the specific hardware etc. are all very interesting … I’ve been reading tons over the weekend. The debian docu is excellent!
Lumpy Gravy : “Is it true that the installation procedure automatically installs Gnome as default desktop and that thereâs nothing one can do about this? I would much prefer to have a neat & tidy Xfce desktop as default and then add various apps over time.”
The answer is yes, you can install XFCE then add additional apps you want (without having Gnome or KDE). During the installation when you get to software installation…uncheck the box for “Desktop Environment” and just have “standard system” checked. You should get a barebones system after installation without X or a desktop manager. Then when your logged in via command line type in as root user (su -) :
apt-get install xfce4 xserver-xorg
or
aptitude install xfce4 xserver-xorg
you might not have to type in xserver-org but to be on the safe side I would include it in just in case. That will then install XFCE 4 & xorg only…and then you can add additional apps via apt-get / aptitude / synaptic / whatever in XFCE. Beauty of Linux and Debian. Cheeers…
anant : whenever your project gets off the ground feel free to use the contact form (look at the top of this webpage) and send me info and I’ll be happy to post news announcements on your project.
Laika has explained the reasons for the renaming and rebranding of the Mozilla apps in Debian. There’s no point in going on and on about this. I actually like the names IceWeasel and IceDove better than Mozilla’s originals … they’re more peaceful … all that thunder and fire stuff scares me! :-)
Luna, that was an excellent review! Like some others here, I have learned things from your console exercises. However, there are still things I would have liked to know before I begin to install Debian (still downloading the DVDs). Is it true that the installation procedure automatically installs Gnome as default desktop and that there’s nothing one can do about this? I would much prefer to have a neat & tidy Xfce desktop as default and then add various apps over time. Don’t like bloated monsters like Konqueror or Nautilus …
thanks luna6 for adding the screen shots.
i am interested in working on the development of a graphical installer, besides this i also have few more interests,
1) i belong to india, we have very limited bandwidth problem so i am planning to make a backup repository for the debian packages that i have downloaded yet, all the packages are in apt download cache.
2) i wanted to include some of my favorite packages in the Debian installer disk.
3) i wanted to work on GUI installer for Debian and was willing to work on its enhancement and other addition, including a game during the installation so as to cut short the time consuming efforts
any help in this regard will be highly appreciable.
thanks in advance
The name change to Iceweasel shows the strength of free software. The Mozilla people wanted to link certain restrictions to the Firefox name, and the Debian people only had to switch to the nearly identical GNU version to comply with Mozilla and give their users the same functionality. There’s a good writeup at:
http://lwn.net/Articles/200857/
Anyone can make mistakes, and I think that Mozilla did here. But since Firefox is free software, a simple “fork you” is enough to keep everyone honest and happy.
Am I the only Debian user who uses aptitude instead of apt-get to install packages ? Sure, its gui is not as atractive as Synaptic (which uses apt-get), but it is an improvement over apt-get the debian folks came up with. Here’s a good overview on how to use aptitude’s GUI (you can use it like apt-get as well, i.e. “aptitude search/update/install/etc”):
http://jobezone.wordpress.com/2006/03/17/aptitude-in-30-seconds/
Perhaps what would be excellent for the future, would be Synaptic start using aptitude as its backend!
Anant : doing a new review with the graphical installer is out of the question, but I did add screenshots for the graphical installer and mentioned how to install with the graphical installer (type “installgui” at the first install screen). Cheers and thanks for pointing that out.
UncleSam : I haven’t tried the 64 bit version, but your problem sounds like maybe disc read error or maybe a bad download of the disc itself. I would recommend you check your iso download and make sure it is fine then reburn the disc (maybe at a slower speed).
Hy,
I have some trouble in my debian installation.
I have an Athlon 64 X2 processor and I choose the AMD64 installer (with DVD).
During installation, when it installs my kernel, it can not find it.
I see the var/log and it couldn’t find cdrom//pool/…/kernel-….deb.
So, I can’t finalise installation.
Have you some idea ?
hello sir,
thanks for the valuable release.
well i can call my self a new debian user, i firslt installed 3.1 sarge (text based installer.)
then within a few days i got a hint about the gui installer of debian,
so i downloaded the debian installer for etch. the graphical installer is also wroking great although it may seem to be a bit simillar to text mode and not that graphical but is a good start to go with, coz a lot of new users still like to use the mouse while installing.
so i will request one more favour from you,
kindly present a graphical installer review or if any already available the kindly post its link.
yours
anant
Oh, nuts…I meant Fedora 6.
Many thanks for these reviews. I try lots of downloadable Linux distros and to find a review that puts TONS of tweaks and enhancements right in front me so I don’t have to try and figure them out myself is a very charitable thing. I appreciate it greatly.
I tried the steps to get Firefox 6 going and found the help very useful and time-saving.
Debian Etch on AMD64 has been mostly enjoyable, but to carry the discussion further, regarding the whole ‘Firefox/IceWeasel’ thing, this…
I tried installing the 32-bit version of Firefox, and it won’t because a ‘libgtk-x11.blah.blah.blah’ library was missing. I have tried everything that I can think of to install it, and have read a few ideas through Google, and it flat-out won’t. Nor will SeaMonkey.
I tried installing 32-bit java on Etch/64 as well, and can’t. So far.
Other distros have managed to accomodate 32-bit in their 64-bit versions. SuSE is the best I’ve seen so far. I wish Debian was as accomodating.
I understand the argument that Deb is stable for servers. I understand the argument that stability comes at the expense of usability. I guess what I’d like to see is ability for a user to screw up Debian if they want to. Sort of a: ‘click here to allow all sorts of usability garbage to be installed that will taint the build but allow lots of stuff’ button.
In spite of it all, though, Debian Etch has been fun.
I appreciate that the Deb maintainers aren’t interested in ‘market penetration’. Too bad many of the freeloaders like me who download it don’t respect that and make inane commentary about how Linux will never be successful because its too hard. Too bad. Go try Ubuntu or Linspire or some other ‘easy Linux’.
Oh, and I like OSX too. For different reasons than why I like Deb Etch. I don’t expect both to be the same, though. That’s just illogical.
Gnome 2.18 for Debian Etch:
click here
Congratulations, we are getting several people referencing this howto on the Debian forums and they are all installing the Nvidia drivers the wrong way! Could you please ammend this so that the proper way, the Debian way is also mentioned? Using Nvidia script is a great way to cause problems and everything you need is already in apt unless you absolutely have to have the latest greatest Nvidia drivers. Thank you.
It’s dead simple to do:
http://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers
Agreed with the Firefox/IceWeasel name confusion.
While I understand it’s because of the licence restrictions, I do think it gives a bad impression of the open source community. It may lead some to wonder whether we’re really any different to the proprietary world.
I installed sarge when it first came out and got put off by the frozen login screen. I played around with it a bit but then gave up. openSUSE 10.1 was out around that time and I liked it. Now, from what I read, I think i’ll give Debian etch a try. Thanks for the video setup tips.
Pardon me… :)
Iâm wArmly recommending Etch to everyoneâŠ
About last con’s:
I was very pleased when I saw that new Debian 4.0 is using Gnome 2.14 instead 2.16.
Gnome 2.16 have small but nuisance bug in keyboard layout indicator – when I add fourth language keyboard indicator crash (same on Ubuntu 6.10 and Slackware 11 with Dropline Gnome), so I have to use xkb settings.
Gnome 2.14 and 2.18 keyboard indicator do all fine…
Debian was and still is one of the best Linux distro in production enviroment, with, Slackware beside, of course.
But, Ubuntu is promising too…
I’m wormly recommending Etch to everyone…
Best regards for all.
Lav
The reason they renamed Firefox to Iceweasel is because of idealogical differences between Debian and Mozilla over the percieved use of the Mozilla logo and name.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iceweasel
This evening, we just upgraded a Sarge box to Etch. The upgrade was almost anticlimactic; no problems. The Debian folks sure do chicken right.
As for the Firefox name change, I wouldn’t have used something as childish as “Iceweasel”, but I certainly can understand why they changed the name.
Scott H – thanks that fixed it, really think Etch is the best Debian release to date. nice job guys!
Michael Says:
April 12th, 2007 at 8:17 am
Anybody experiencing jagged fonts in IceWeasel with an LCD monitor? Besides that problem Etch works great.
—> Install the Microsoft core fonts package to
correct.
Nice write up. I am looking forward to using Etch. :)
The Firefox/Iceweasel thing is not Debian refusing not to abide the license, it is in fact the Debian developers abiding the terms of the license exactly. It is the _license_ that does not allow for stable versioning that Debian “stable” is famous for. The Firefox license does not allow for security patches to be applied, but requires the new version of Firefox to be used in its entirety.
Debian “Stable” means stable in the packages available. That is why Debian stable is not what most people would choose for their desktop machines. But for “business” systems, servers, anything where stability and predictability is important, Debian Stable will be exactly the right tool for the job.
Anybody experiencing jagged fonts in IceWeasel with an LCD monitor? Besides that problem Etch works great.
Thank you for very nice review,I got great tips for video card too..I installed etch on an old amd800 and is running very fine.
I also love Dreamlinux based on 100% debian ,which is running on 3 machines perfectly.
I too agree that stupid name changes confuse people. I think Firefox was the one who was a bit childish. More importantly, I’m now concerned about Mozilla and their commitment to FLOSS. Perhaps Mozilla is moving in he wrong direction and Debian shouldn’t be required to follow.
To each his own and I love the real power on the (not like DOS) command line as well but everything DOES also need a GUI alternative to appeal to the newbie and I have zero problem with this. I just can’t understand why they are (sometimes) so much more slow (given memory). They do the same things.
Also, don’t you know we just need a Kubuntu like (optionally installed) boot splash BUT with a single key (ESC) that then shows all the details when desired and in a more ordered list (with pause/page_down too). It’s the beat of all worlds/preferences.
Thank God for Debian or we’d have no real option.
Some gnome-2.16 packages are also present.AFAIK 2.18 brings on improvements but a stable gnome is much preferable.
“Gnome 2.14 comes installed by default – rather than Gnome 2.16″
I’ve read in a Debian mailing list, some developers planning on backporting 2.16 (See http://backports.org ).
@ MacLone :) please if it was “for the people” why does it only run on apple products?
MAC = EFI = NOT NICE :)
@Piotr lol nice
:) I personally like console, you can fix stuff that normally wouldn’t be fixable in a windows situation :) (unless safe mode or something was used)
There is nothing wrong with the “learning” thing, if you want to learn to code…well, we have Debian…but i think an OS whatever should be designed “for the people” not for the 3 geeks out there.
Goodafternoon,
mzilikazi, Debian supports 12 architectures. Let me see how many NetBSD supports (will start counting from 12) ..12…25…30..46..54 (ok I don’t remember, ca 54).
:)
Piotr
Ohhh I almost forget to say something…
I own a macbook… and is running a ubuntu. The hardware is a precious, but the software is just like windows.
Love freedom. And i’m going to sell my macbook and buy an HP.
I have to say sorry to the mac comunity, but i don’t like very much the OSX.
Please…. OSX is Darwing, not linux. Is BSD.
In the other hand… is the best USER oriented system.
In some way slow but stable.
Don’t get in a discusion with no destination. There’re several Operating Systems and all are good to different purpouses.
Still Window$ is good in some very strange aspect.
@ Stodge
Why is it that there is always one fanboy to come along and interject some nonsense that is completely irrelevant to the article at hand?
OK you wanted to go in that direction…..last I checked OSX runs on an extremely limited set of hardware. Debian runs on let’s see…1,2 no wait…..3,4,5,….no wait…still more….6,7,8…11,12! 12 architectures including your very expensive macwhatever. ;) You bought OSX preinstalled from Apple and it works. GREAT! I built a box with all Linux compatible hardware. I install Debian, it works. You (like so many others) are comparing apples to oranges (no pun intended). So if we follow your logic I would be able to complain that OSX doesn’t run on my system. Linux runs on (almost) anything. I hate to burst your bubble but there are far more Linux users than OSX users. In fact, you’re already A Linux user just like anyone else that has ever used the internet or google. Please give my regards to your puppetmaster Mr Jobs and quit showing your ass in public.
excellent review. I am near tickled to try Debian out now after this review. It looks polished and no different from what I am used to now. Alas, Ubuntu comes preconfigured. But this is a great way to hack your own system to the way you like. Very educational.
This was one of the most informative reviews I have ever read.
thanks! it is very nice review!
In relation to your Iceweasel comment, read:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iceweasel#Debian_Iceweasel_appears
why didn’t you get the nvidia drivers from the debian repositories?
“Boo hoo, I have to type something into a console instead of just pointing and clicking icons all the time.”
Computers (note the distinction to be made here between ACTUAL computers and ‘appliances’, the category under which both Macs and VCRs fall) are (shock, horror!) incredibly complex pieces of technology. Open source software allows you to embrace this by giving you the ability to modify code as you wish, to perform any function you like on almost any hardware you can name. If you like the idea of closed, proprietary, cookie-cutter software running on a fixed appliance so long as it’s point-and-click-easy to use, then stop complaining and go back to your Macs – just shut up and understand that some people actually enjoy learning about technology beyond widgets and iChat.
There is no Xfce 4.4 in Etch
It is only Xfce 3.99 (the RC version !) and i think it is very disappointing to have an RC version in a stable release.
Oy… Of course in using the nVidia drivers instead of the pre-packaged Debian packages you will lose X sometime in the future due to nVidia’s attitude that every distro keeps every file in the same place so a security update of an xorg package will over-write some of the files that nVidia’s driver package requires to operate correctly.
Newer drivers, pre-packaged for Debian can be found here: http://people.debian.org/~rdonald/index.php
You did not try the latest GUI installer for debian.
Try out GUI installer by typing intallgui or expertgui at the command prompt while booting debian install DVD
Great, 21 months of work and we still need to write a lot in the console. I understand the goal of Debian as a basic distro but i think Linux has matured enough to avoid the console, why still need to use it?
I completely agree with nix. Reading through that extended monologue about all the configurations and manual editing needed to get your desired desktop was to the point of being almost unbelievable. I mean in this day and age you must be joking. No wonder Debian is far behind the curve. I appreciate the candid and thorough review but my goodness that was painful to read.
“Just one look at this page is a clear explanation why Linux hasnât gained popularity on the desktop. Manual editing of configuration files and lots of cryptic commands is not what a lot of people want. Itâs this reason more and more people are migrating to OSX.”
LOL
You mentioned that Etch is stable. Did any of the programs crash since you have been using it?
Good review. I learned some cryptic. How do I make gnome 2.16 as the default window manager?
@luna6–
Excellent review. You were fair and even-handed. I learned several things from your comments and have bookmarked this page. I don’t recommend Etch for newbies as it requires some configuration, but then it’s highly configurable and you can make of it what you want. I’ve been using it for more than a year and hold Etch and the Debian developers in high regard. Yea, I know they’re a noisy bunch, but that’s democracy. Thanks again for the review.
@ Mic:
Install the “build-essentials” package and the source AND the kernel-headers for the kernel that you are using right now. (uname -r)
What you need depends on the things that the installer for the wireless-module needs (read the README :P). But it’s always safe to have those things installed.
Just in case.
@ luna6:
Hell, STOP USING APT-GET AND USE APTITUDE. Even the Debian-people say so. Aptitude is better, cleverer and … ok, it’s not faster.
http://lwn.net/Articles/212199/
Thank you.
sarge did not take three years to come out, it took 18 months. it was woody that took forever. so etch makes it two releases in a row they’ve met their release timeframe goals (18-21 months).
I am new to linux and saw that you install the linux-headers-2.6.18-4-k7 package.
I am trying to build a module for the usb wireless adapter that I am currently using. Was looking through forums and site and noticed some talking about installing kernel source, others about installing linux-header, in order to be able to compile stuff in debian.
Have been googling for the differences but do not quite understand the differences and is quite lost. Appreciate if you could advise what is the diffenence between the two and their uses.
Thanks in advance for the information.
:-)
@ Konstantin : don’t you think that is a little close minded?
yes, i am lunux user, and after all this you describe, i will never even try debian. pclinuxos, radically simple, just the way i love it.
mzilikazi – cntrl+alt+f1 wasn’t an option at that point because the system was completely frozen. thanks for bringing up the alt. methods of installing nvidia though.
laika – appreciate the added piece on iceweasel/firefox. I still have a problem with choice of names, but lets see if that remains.
cheers
:) thanks for the great review, I really enjoyed reading it, big fan of Debian linux.
@ mzilikazi : I would have to agree with you on the re-branding issue :)
if people really want Firefox then can download it from http://www.Mozilla.com
Nice review. :-)
One detail that I disagree with in this review is the Firefox/Iceweasel issue. Debian didn’t re-brand or fork Firefox & Co. They just compiled those applications without the official branding (i.e. icons and logos) and renamed them. Mozilla gives you a perfect right to do that.
If you use a source-based distro and compile Firefox, you’ll have an option to build it without the official branding. The resulting binary is almost identical to Firefox, only it will be named “Bon Echo”, which is the name that Mozilla has chosen for an unbranded Firefox binary. It’s still Mozilla’s firefox — you’re just not allowed to call it Firefox. But you *are* allowed to call it whatever you want: “Bon Echo” or “Iceweasel” or whatever.
If you choose to build Firefox from source *with* the official branding, the Mozilla license places some additional restrictions on how you can distribute to your friends the binary you’ve compiled. Debian doesn’t consider such restrictions compatible with their conception of “Free Software”.
So how should Debian have solved the problem? Should Debian keep the official branding and place Firefox into the “non-free” package archive? Well, instead doing that, Debian decided to comply to Mozilla’s rules and to just build the Firefox binary without the offiial branding, and then to call it “Iceweasel”.
The Mozilla people were happy and the Debian people were happy. Only some (but not many) Debian users have complained — usually because they don’t know the whole story.
Good article. Some suggestions:
To fix xorg.conf you don’t really need to boot into another distro. CTRL+ALT+F1 puts you on a virtual terminal. Log in as root, nano /etc/X11/xorg.conf OR the proper way is dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
Alternatively, you could simply append ’single’ to the GRUB prompt at boot and you will boot to a prompt.
Using Nvidia’s installer for their drivers is not at all advisable on a Debian system. That installer puts things in non-standard places. Additionally, if you boot more than 1 kernel you have to reinstall the drivers each time you switch kernels! That’s just silly. It would be better to add a testing, unstable or even experimental repo and do it the Debian way which is quite simple.
http://wiki.debian.org/NvidiaGraphicsDrivers
I guess as long as you don’t mix both methods you should be ok.
Easy way to get your kernel headers:
apt-get install linux-headers-$(uname -r)
I won’t counter-argue your points about Debian renaming Firefox. The bottom line is, it did not fit into Debian policy – period.
Thanks for the write up!
Just one look at this page is a clear explanation why Linux hasn’t gained popularity on the desktop. Manual editing of configuration files and lots of cryptic commands is not what a lot of people want. It’s this reason more and more people are migrating to OSX.